The broccoli fraud

Broccoli has been marketed and sold as food that has health benefits to the user, with the idea that people should eat it in order to get their servings of vegetables, and as a good source of Protein, Vitamin E (Alpha Tocopherol), Thiamin, Riboflavin, Pantothenic Acid, Calcium, Iron, Magnesium, Phosphorus and Selenium, and a very good source of Dietary Fiber, Vitamin A, Vitamin C, Vitamin K, Vitamin B6, Folate, Potassium and Manganese.

Well, guess what? I eat it because I like it — not for any of those reasons above. In fact, I’m getting most of that stuff from other foods and wouldn’t need to eat broccoli at all, but I do anyway because I like it. Sometimes I cook with it just to have the color green in the dish.

Yep. That’s right. Broccoli as a healthy food is a fraud, because it’s being used for other purposes. Oh, sure, there are some people who benefit from its healthy characteristics, but there’s a whole lot who eat it cause it tastes good.

That’s about as absurd as Mark Kleiman’s latest attack on “medical marijuana in scare quotes.”

Some sick people get relief from whole cannabis, but “medical marijuana” is a political fraud, and the “medical marijuana” business is mostly a sham, with most of the volume going to non-medical users – many of them with diagnosable cannabis use disorder – and resellers.

Who the fuck cares?

The key thing is the very first sentence fragment: “Some sick people get relief from whole cannabis.” Period. The rest is just posturing and nonsense.

Remember, there are two ways that medical marijuana can be used politically. One, where they allow sick people to legally get the medicine recommended by their doctor, and also end up with many others finding a way to get this recreational drug from a safer source than criminals. And two, where they callously deny sick people something that could, in some cases, save their lives (or at least improve the quality of their life), in order to continue a failed and destructive policy of prohibition. The two aren’t even closely comparable on the scale of evil.

Mark also declares:

…the variation in natural cannabis means that “marijuana” isn’t the name of a medicine; a medicine is a material of known chemical composition that has been shown in clinical trials to be safe and effective in the management of some condition in some group of patients.

In this way, he decides to define “medicine” as “not-marijuana” — a trick that’s been used by the government for decades.

(‘Gee, they found more medical uses for marijuana — I guess we’ll just have to re-define medicine once again to exclude it. A plant isn’t medicine. Medicine isn’t smoked. Medicine doesn’t have multiple compounds. Medicine isn’t medicine unless the pharmaceutical companies can patent it and make a profit off it.’)

Well, the FDA and Congress aren’t the only ones who can define the word “medicine” (thank God!)

Marijuana (or more properly, cannabis) is, in fact, the name of a medicine. It also happens to be a pretty damned good recreational drug.

And, it could add some green to my dishes.

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37 Responses to The broccoli fraud

  1. CarolDuhart2 says:

    Why can’t it be like tea? Tea can be both pleasurable and sooth a sore throat at the same time. Many spices and herbs can be both medicine and flavoring.

    In any event, this is really the anti-pleasure cops talking. If it’s medicine, it shouldn’t also make you feel pleasure as well, even if the pleasure is also needed for pain relief. Codeine can be a relief from discomfort and relaxing at the same time-indeed the effect is an essential part of pain relief. Or should relief also feel flat and mechanical in order to meet certain people’s approval?

    • Windy says:

      What about Valium? That makes some people feel pleasure, high. And what about all those anti-depressants aren’t they supposed to elevate the mood of the people who take them?

      • Duncan20903 says:


        Those anti-depressants have been put through rigorous trials and are FDA approved! What is involved in these very strict and rigorous trials to prove that anti-depressants work? The “researcher” asks the trial subjects, “…and how does that make you feel?” If enough of the study subjects say, “oooh, that’s much better now!” it’s scientifically proven to work. Now that hasn’t been done with cannabis. “Medicinal” cannabis users only have anecdotal evidence when they say “oooh, that’s much better now!” So now do you see the difference? C’mon, it’s right in front of your face! There were no fatherly, scientist looking guys dressed in labcoats asking the merrywanna addicts for their opinions!

        • darkcycle says:

          Damn. You blew the whole lid right off my entire former profession. Now what are all those fatherly lookin’ people in white lab coats gonna do? There aren’t a whole lot of jobs suited to people with heads full of cottony fluff, you know. I suppose my former colleagues fondness for obfuscating jargon could come in handy somewhere…but, damn.
          SO,are YOU feeling any better, Duncan?

  2. thelbert says:

    “Medicine isn’t medicine unless the pharmaceutical companies can patent it and make a profit off it.” that sentence is the reason i feel justified in disregarding cannabis prohibition. the very dishonesty of the prohibitches causes me to want nothing to do with them. except to disobey.

    • Duncan20903 says:



      So aspirin isn’t a medicine? It’s been off patent for close to, if not more than a century.

      Why not try it this way: “Medicine isn’t medicine unless someone is willing to pony up several million dollars to do the studies required for FDA approval.” Because aspirin was “generally accepted as safe” when the modern FDA approval protocol was implemented those trials were never required.

      IMO one of the most perverse ironies ever is that the catalyst for the onerous FDA approval process was the horrid birth defects suffered by children whose mothers took Thalidomide while pregnant. So would that onerous process have prevented those birth defects when we consider the fact that pregnant women aren’t eligible to be included in Phase 3 (human) trials? Another irony: Thalidomide was prescribed to pregnant women to relieve morning sickness. Without doubt those poor women should have stuck with the cannabis.

  3. O.B.Server says:

    Yeah, that was pretty nutty, even for Kleiman. His strategy seems to be: get flack from ‘both’ sides, then, define ‘the middle of the road’; define yourself as a moderate, reasonable centrist, etc. Such synthetic triangulation, as you say, looks like pure posturing.

    Maybe Kleiman will unblock my comment there (not holding my breath), where I quoted The High And Most Holy U.S. Government’s (blessed be its holy name!) angelic department, the NIH, calling St. John’s Wort medicinal. (I.e. a plant, just like cannabis.) If calling cannabis “medicine” is a fraud, then so also must be his most worshipful Government Department, for proclaiming the same about the St. John’s Wort plant.

    Denying cannabis is medicine or medicinal etc. doesn’t pass the straight face test. Not in 2015.

    And excellent point about “broccoli”, also.

    “Let thy food be thy medicine, and thy medicine be thy food” – Hippocrates (c.460 – c.370 BC)

    I don’t think I am alone in predicting that in a few years, the daily juicing of raw, whole cannabis will be an essential part of a well-balanced dietary plan of letting thy medicine … just be.

    Government, as Orwell said in 1984, is forever seeking to limit us, to constrain our very thought. Sometimes government tries this by playing word games like equivocation. Those who try to convince us that words should now mean only what they dictate are the real frauds.

    • Freeman says:

      O.B. – Well of course we all know (k)Lie-man will never allow anything that rebuts his conception of “truth” to grace the pages of the Ministry of Reality unless he thinks he has some witty come-back. Informed commenters are NOT his intended audience, as the tone and content of messaging found there is so obviously tailored to the ignorant prejudices of the uninformed.

      But if he’s moderating comments, he’s reading them, so I went ahead and left one to keep yours company in permanent comment purgatory:

      Pete Guither’s got your number. Couldn’t have said it better. Cheers and a Happy New Year to the Winston Smiths at the Ministry of Reality.

      • Emma says:

        Kleiman’s audience is bureaucrats and politicians who might buy the services of his consulting group BOTEC (back of the envelope consulting).

  4. Duncan20903 says:


    Medicine doesn’t have multiple compounds? Excedrin is 250 mg aspirin, 250 mg acetaminophen, and 65 mg caffeine. Now there’s some inspired retail pharmacology. What the heck is the caffeine supposed to fix? Well, caffeine withdrawals can include a severe headache which a dose of caffeine quickly cures. The recommended dose is 2 tablets and 130 mg of caffeine is a a pretty good jolt. Has anyone else noticed that Coca Cola has started to list the actual dose of caffeine in a “serving”? A half liter of Coke has 48 mg of caffeine according to the label on the bottle I’m holding in my hand.

    Have I ever mentioned that “The Professor” is nothing more than a confidence artist?

  5. claygooding says:

    I think I will listen to Dr Lester Grinspoon’s and Dr Gupta’s opinions on the efficacy of marijuana/cannabis/hemp before I will take the word of a part time adviser to the ONDCP on drug policy whose ineptitude is proven both in a failed drug policy and setting up a legal marijuana market.
    His hatred for MMJ is why WA state is attempting to shut down the MMJ program to get tax revenue from patients.

    Fuck Mark Klieman and his opinion.

  6. Eridani says:

    Lol, I have very severe “cannabis use disorder” and the only effective medicine is medical marijuana.

  7. Freeman says:

    “a medicine is a material of known chemical composition that has been shown in clinical trials to be safe and effective in the management of some condition in some group of patients”

    Someone needs to inform the CDC that pharmaceuticals are NOT “medicine”, but rather a “fraud” because they are regularly abused for non-medically necessary purposes (and they’re not even close to “safe” in so many cases — while we still have yet to hear news of that first cannabis overdose death).

  8. DdC says:


    Marijuana Compound Spurs Brain Cell Growth
    When it comes to the controversy surrounding medical marijuana, an international team of researchers is busy stirring the pot by releasing findings that suggest the drug helps promote brain cell growth while treating mood disorders.

    Marijuana May Spur New Brain Cells
    Scientists said that marijuana appears to promote the development of new brain cells in rats and have anti-anxiety and anti-depressant effects, a finding that could have an impact on the national debate over medical uses of the drug.

    Marijuana May Live Up To Be The Elixir of Life
    A study by University of Saskatchewan researchers suggests beneficial aspects of smoking marijuana at least among rats, who appear to have sprouted new brain cells and besides benefiting from reduced depression and anxiety.

    Study Turns Pot Wisdom on Head
    Forget the stereotype about dopey potheads. It seems marijuana could be good for your brain. While other studies have shown that periodic use of marijuana can cause memory loss and impair learning and a host of other health problems down the road, new research suggests the drug could have some benefits when administered regularly in a highly potent form. Most “drugs of abuse” such as alcohol, heroin, cocaine and nicotine suppress growth of new brain cells. However, researchers found that cannabinoids promoted generation of new neurons in rats’ hippocampuses.

    The Tree of Life…
    She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her:
    and happy is every one that retaineth her. Prov.3 [18]

  9. steves says:

    I guess I look at it a little differently. I don’t particularly look at it as medical need versus medical/ recreational versus just good old recreational use. I think the push for medical was what it took for these disillusioned idiots to actually be able to grasp the value of the plant regardless of how much benefit there is. It was and is a means to an end so that people can see that the government should not be able to put legal restrictions on a naturally growing plant.

    • DdC says:

      Are you Rick? No matter, Welcome to the couch…

    • darkcycle says:

      Unless you happen to actually need it….maybe Charlotte Figgy or anybody else who’s life has been saved by it sees it differently. I certainly wouldn’t be here on the couch right now without it. In fact, without it, I would have been dead before the close of the 1990’s. In 1994 I weighed 165lbs. By 1996 I was down to 109, and still losing weight uncontrollably.
      It was a means to an end, alright. But in my case, that end wasn’t legalization, though I have been fighting all these years to do that. Your opinion disrespects anybody ever helped by medical laws.

  10. claygooding says:

    CNBC’s “Marijuana Country: The Cannabis Boom” Will Premiere on January 5 at 9PM ET/PT

    A year after Colorado passed one of the most permissive pot laws in the world, CNBC and correspondent Harry Smith return to the state to chart the rise of a new American industry and report on the results of this unprecedented social experiment. Smith profiles the most successful marijuana merchant in Denver, who hopes to expand his family-run business to other states as they follow Colorado’s lead and legalize the sale of marijuana for recreational use. He explores the new world of cannabis-infused edibles and the sale of pot brownies, chocolates and even soda, which has led to some confusion and controversy over dosing and portion size. CNBC cameras also follow two pot dealers – one of them a U.S. Army veteran – who profit from a black market that funnels the drug across state lines and continues to thrive despite the new law.”SNIP”

    I love it when business channels run these,,especially since they have dropped a lot of the lame pot humor from the shows.

    • claygooding says:

      My comment at the article:

      Since this is alleged to be a “business” channel perhaps someone could explain how a legal market that opens up in an established market is expected to reduce the black market when it allows the street dealers to raise prices because growers want black market wages for growing it,,retailers want black market profits selling it and legislators want retirement homes on the coast from it’s sale?

      So they can protect the children,,no doubt.

  11. Dave says:

    Just wait till he finds out that not only is laughter not the “best” medicine, it’s not even FDA approved. How long has this fraud been perpetrated on the american people?

  12. Freeman says:

    So, “‘Medical Marijuana’ is a political fraud”, eh? I DARE the guy to tell that to Trey and Angela Brown’s face. The moral derpitude involved in promoting the sort of control-freak attitude that results in patients being denied the only treatment that has been shown to work when all else has already failed simply because some of it might be “going to non-medical users – many of them with diagnosable cannabis use disorder” is staggering. The post is nothing more than arrant snobbery masquerading as intellect.

    I gotta agree with the victim’s mom: “The prosecutor’s version of this is that a good mom allows her child to be in pain, to self-harm, and attempt to take his life,” she told Valley News Live. “I guess that’s a good mom in his eyes.” Yeah, (k)Lie-man’s eyes too, it would seem.

    And speaking of “political fraud”, it’s good to remind ourselves of a couple of points:

    1) (k)Lie-man is not a medical doctor. His PhD is in political science, not medicine. So it’s a good thing that he has clarified his opinion that mmj is a “political” fraud, because he’s never been qualified to tell anyone that it is a medical fraud. And like Pete says: “Who the fuck cares?” Political fraud is the norm. Political honesty would be the aberration, assuming one could cite an example of such.

    2) For textbook examples of “political fraud” regarding cannabis, far exceeding all conceivable mmj fraud, one need look no further than the history of marijuana prohibition. Nobody can cite a claim about mmj more obviously and preposterously fraudulent than “after two puffs on a marijuana cigarette, I was turned into a bat” – Dr. James Munch, the US’s Narcotics Bureau “official expert” on marijuana until 1962, testifying before a jury.

    As (k)Lie-man has amply demonstrated, if one is to make the case that mmj is a gross political fraud of great consequence, one must ignore the very much larger political fraud of very much more consequence that is mj prohibition.

  13. Servetus says:

    Without citing any numbers or references to back his extraordinary claims, Doc Kleiman believes most medical marijuana consumers are faking their medical needs for the well-publicized entourage effects provided by marijuana’s cannabinoid and terpene compounds. In doing so, Kleiman boasts an incredibly cynical view of society, as well as the medical and scientific professions that contradict his beliefs in anti-marijuana folklore.

    Kleiman’s thinking resembles someone suffering from an obsessive compulsive trait exhibited by extreme scrupulosity. He’s like a physics professor I once knew who discounted Albert Einstein’s contributions to physics because Einstein divorced his first wife, and was therefore allegedly too immoral to be a “good” physicist. Crazy people who conduct themselves like the errant physics teacher are totalitarians. On a national level, they tend to set impossible standards that cannot possibly be fulfilled in order to keep various adherents in line:

    This pathetic moral spectacle would not be necessary if the original rules were ones that it would be possible to obey. But to the totalitarian edicts that begin with revelation from absolute authority, and that are enforced by fear, and based on a sin that had been committed long ago, are added regulations that are often immoral and impossible at the same time. The essential principle of totalitarianism is to make laws that are impossible to obey.

    The resulting tyranny is even more impressive if it can be enforced by a privileged caste or party which is highly zealous in the detection of error. Most of humanity, throughout its history, has dwelt under a form of this stupefying dictatorship, and a large portion of it still does.—Christopher Hitchens; God is Not Great, p. 212.

    And from Noam Chomsky:

    Harvard Professor of the Science of Government Samuel Huntington, who quite frankly explained the need to delude the public about the Soviet threat 30 years ago, urged more generally that power must remain invisible: The architects of power in the United States must create a force that can be felt but not seen. Power remains strong when it remains in the dark; exposed to the sunlight it begins to evaporate. An important lesson for those who want power to devolve to the public, a critical battle that is fought daily.

    By World War I, business leaders and elite intellectuals recognized that the population had won so many rights that they could not be controlled by force, so it would be necessary to turn to control of attitudes and opinions.

    Nothing keeps citizens in the dark quite like the drug war. Doc Kleiman’s continuing tirade against marijuana (besides verging on practicing medicine without a license) is designed to create an impossible standard for the average person to breach, anyone in this case who suffers from a disease that can be remediated by one or more marijuana compounds. And that makes Mark Kleiman little more than an advocate of standard-policy government tyranny, and a petty tyrant in his own right.

  14. NorCalNative says:


    I dare anyone to go to Mr. Kleiman’s blog and type “endocannabinoid system” into his site’s search engine.

    Hint: you won’t find ONE REFERENCE!

    And, that should tell you EVERYTHING you need to know about his public relations work for the “treatment industry.”

    Cannabis-based medicines ARE POLY-THERAPEUTIC in their effects on the endocannabinoid system and homeostasis. Enhancing homeostasis by putting metabolic pressure on one’s ECS is MEDICAL regardless of intended reason for use.


    I totally get it that herbs and herbal synergy are problematic to Western ideas about medicine (allopathic). However, if you want honest info about cannabis and the speaker ignores the ECS that’s a pretty good “tell” that they’re protecting wealth and power and using propaganda.

    Any discussion of the medical and mental-touristic use of cannabis without the Endocannabinoid system and homeostasis whether through ignorance OR deception is a false argument designed to serve the interests of Big Pharma.

    So, is Kleiman ignorant or dishonest? Or both?

  15. Freeman says:

    The thing is, fraud usually involves a victim. The victim is usually promised one thing and delivered another, presumably inferior thing instead. So if mmj is fraudulent, why are the “victims” coming back for more instead of complaining that they’ve been lied to and ripped off?

  16. thelbert says:

    fraud or not the AG of colorado wants some research on strains of marijuana available to the citizens of his state, rather than the stuff from mississippi:

  17. Poca says:

    Kleiman’s argument is convenient for framing the discussion of regulation to support his sin taxes like they have in WA. Trying to stick it to us “frauds” as he puts it-as if the high taxes are in any way justified. If there were no medical, then the regulators in WA’d have an easier time of taxing herb. He is trying to help the asshole bureaucrats get talking points, but it is clear how self serving the BS coming from his high horse falls flat.

    The travesty in the whole medical cannabis thing is the fact that it isn’t Over The Counter for 18+ and the whole charade of having to see the doc about it. It is plain that Ganja is so safe there should be no need to get an Rx ( if u want to be a dick “recommendation” <- case in point)

  18. DdC says:

    Republican policies are destroying the middle class and selling our government off to the highest bidder. It’s nearly treasonous.

    Sad, but absolutely true.

    Totally agree and can’t understand why Democrats support them?

    Why Do Democrats Defend Nixon’s Drug War?

    Community Alert:

    Democrats have been wondering around taking polls on how to act. In the process they seem to have lost their Backbone. Or maybe they just discovered their leadership are Neocons. Still PC over reality and more time defending themselves over loonies ramblings than progressing. Compromising on sanity itself. As obvious as the truth behind the prohibition of cannabis in all forms.

    2016 Priorities Survey

    Here are 13 issues where Democrats are working to make progress. Of these issues, please check up to three that are most important to you: continued…

    Why Democrats Are Reportedly Turning Their Backs on Debbie Wasserman Schultz

    Why Do Democrats Defend Nixon’s Drug War?

  19. David says:

    Are there any statistics that back up “Professor” Kleiman’s claim that most mmj users are fraudulent? I happen to think it’s true (and am glad, since mj laws are immoral), but on a website trumpeting the value of facts, what are the facts?

    Is Aloe Vera not a medicine? Yes it is, BOTH in it’s raw cactus form, and also in it’s various processed forms. Ditto for marijuana, no matter how many people use it fraudulently. “Professor” Kleiman is not entitled to his own facts, yet he keeps pretending otherwise.

  20. MJ Verite says:

    Kleiman’s arrogance is all the more amazing in that he truly has little to be arrogant about.

    After decades in healthcare, I realize I never really knew what medicine was. All hail the great and powerful Kleiman.

  21. Freeman says:

    Just posted at (k)Lie-man’s article at

    For a guy who is fond of citing self-reported NSDUH survey results as scientific fact to bolster his claim that millions upon millions of cannabis consumers “meet diagnostic criteria” for substance use disorders, I find it interesting that the author seems to be claiming that the 92% of medical marijuana patients who self-report that “medical marijuana alleviated symptoms of their serious medical conditions” in a recent survey are participating in some kind of conspiracy to commit fraud.

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